Zen browser, An advanced modern Firefox fork with a beautiful Apple-like interface
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Curious as to why you point that Chromium extensions are worse than Firefox.
I'm using Arc for Windows atm, and wanted to give a try to competitors like Vivaldi and Zen, but I got stuck quite early on on both for different reasons.
Zen UI is quite lovely tbh, and close to Arc's, but it being Firefox is a massive pain for me. The settings and backend UI sucks compared to Chromium, and I just can't stand it. It feels like the 90s.
Also a big drawback is the extensions support for me. So really curious in what way you think it's better.Just to clarify, I care nothing about privacy. So if that's the bonus, there's none for me.
Vivaldi I was interested due to it being Chromium, and I instantly loved the amount of features. But as many as there are, I feel like it doesn't hit the key ones that Arc nailed having none.
I cannot set bookmarks as vertical, and using vertical tabs as replacements feels lackluster, as they don't seem to hibernate by default. Meaning I cannot reproduce this behaviour from Arc of having everything at my fingertips and switching from one to another easily.
Maybe I'm missing something, or maybe there's an obscure way to achieve it.
Still, the UI feels more like Linux than Apple though. It feels cluttered, with too much extras idc about like the mail and calendar apps. And translator, and that weird sidebar. And bookmarks are just that, bookmarks.
I kinda fell in love with the way Arc manages them.
Am I missing something? Is there a way to achieve what I'm looking for?
Ofc there are things bothering me in Arc. And the community here seems quite gorgeous.
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It is a very nice looking browser which basically looks like my Vivaldi setup by default. The added benefit is multi-account containers. I could enjoy this browser for general usage and webbrowsing, for more powerfull use of the web I certainly prefer Vivaldi where I can have way more customization and completely different setups with the multiple profiles.
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@stilgarwolf The first one
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@Chaoscontrol For me it was the fact that it's Firefox-based that's why I got hyped about it. It's freshened up the UI to the level of Chromium-based browsers in my opinion especially since I have the experience of using browsers with Chrome UI like Brave, ChrOpera.
I get repulsed by a redirect to Chromium settings becuase of how ugly and lacking especially privacy settings and that was how I yeeted Arc browser on my Windows 10 system after about 10 minutes. Vivaldi is the browser on which future ones should base their settings on IMHO.
Even for me, vanilla Firefox settings UI is the ugliest installed GUI I have on my system. But Mozilla has shown to devotees of Firefox a plan to change it for the better... when we all die and our descendants have grandchildren I guess. And Tab groups in Firefox are its GTA6.
I'll wait for Arc on Windows to get polished then I can try it out again but my browser is not GMail Desktop in which I must sign an account. -
@aminought Okay but in Zen, those firefox themes don't apply the way they are expected to in Zen.
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The begun ultra customization by removing horizontal tabs, so I stared at my large screen showing a phonelike browser with tabs listed far, at right end.
No way to use it yet, (but I like it's tab stacking). I'll wait for horizontal tabs. -
@Kjala I am not talking about themes. Theme API is about extensions.
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@aminought I.m not going to pretend like I knew the theming API or what it was but got to learn a few things from the creators themselves https://hacks.mozilla.org/2017/12/using-the-new-theming-api-in-firefox/ and I'm going to try out Tree style tabs with Zen to see how badly TST integrates with Zen in terms of theming.
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@BlackIkeEagle Yeah. It's (Vivaldi) like the browser version of logging into different Desktop Environments.
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I decided to take a look into the browser because of this post and honestly I was pretty underwhelmed so far. I will stick with it because it seems to be in it's infancy given most articles I've seen are a few weeks old but for what it is now it is missing a few things for me to consider it.
Against Firefox it's a no-brainer but against Vivaldi, I only see it as a good alternative if you are doing it solely to go against the google engine monopoly view; which I agree, share needs to be diversified. But in regards to the defaults and the Apple-like claims, idk. It looks like my setup (achieved by changing MAYBE 3 settings) on Vivaldi, with some added in-window rounding. Three things that are needed before I can consider using it in any long term manner.
Out of the box mouse gestures (though I don't often use the mouse to navigate, when I do its just so easy and fast for basic creations, closures etc.), a quick command palette (so much control with little effort + command chains), and the settings which I don't know if Vivaldi can be beaten at.
But given it is still new, I hope that they consider addressing these soon and them adding a stand out feature and then I will consider using it as a secondary.
Sidenote: I'm a developer (pages, apps, extensions) and have a variety of browsers on all my OSs for compatibility testing. Zen is a welcomed addition.
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@Jrograms prev. + page actions, great for my specific usage, easy debugging and navigation with the css tool and page minimap
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@Jrograms I think the only problem with this browser is relying on the promise of Mozilla adding functionality to Firefox of which by the time we and all humanity in 2024 will be a myth.
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No offence, but Zen looks like a Firefox's skin to me...
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@donchen Not really. But I don't know what are your thoughts on Brave's interface in relation to Chrome so...
A skin would only mean a modification only on the user interface. Tile Tabs WE extension can't tile the tabs of a skin like how you can do it with Zen. And you can't mod your skin like you can with Zen. With Zen, you become a little lazy with one-click buttons that instantly modify your browser install. But be it a skin or not, it's a great browser and I'm just glad it exists.
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I agree Zen is a browser with great potential, and when I discovered it in late August I was quite excited about it. However, I got frustrated with it, and decided to retry Vivaldi for the umpteenth time, and this time it blew my mind.
Frustration about Zen, in no particular order:
- themes, i.e. the real ones, not the tweaks, are a mess, many don't work
- it blocked the Suspend function (I am using Linux LMDE), as a consequence of which I had to restart my computer
- pinned tabs change position when Zen is closed then relaunched.
These things will probably get cleared up, so I have not given up on it, but now that I have rediscovered Vivaldi with its myriad options, it will be a tough competition.
Before Zen I tried Floorp, and even though Zen is much younger, right off the bat it is more polished. In Floorp pages load a lot slower, some webpages aren't rendered well or certain functionalities on webpages don't work, certain webpages did not even load whereas they did in Brave.
I even tried Arc when it 1st came out, I tried it on my MacBook Air. Nice, good eye candy, some good features, but boy was the thing slow.
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I have heard a lot of good things about Zen browser lately. Wish it was on Android so I could try it.
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@Granite1 just days ago installed EndeavourOS and now dualbooting with Win10 and can confirm that. htop, F9, nothing happens.
But Zen is in alpha so... we can expect that. -
Chrome devtools keep me on vivaldi but various frustrations with vivaldi over the years have me branch out to look at other options. I've already switched from vivaldi mail to betterbird. At least we have decent options now.
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I would never switch to a browser like Zen for various reasons.
No Widevine VMP. They can't get a license, there has to be a company behind the browser in order to get a license.
I use my browser for media playback too, I like to listen to Spotify, watch Netflix and watch live tv and sport channels from my local tv provider.
Zen can't play anything of the above.
Zen is based on Firefox ESR. Over time ESR will be less secure than the regular release of Firefox.
So I don't see the point of using a Firefox fork instead of Firefox which is a browser that is so customizable like Vivaldi is.
You can have any kind of interface you want in it with CSS and you can make it as privacy focused you want if you don't like the defaults it has.
I just don't see the point, if I ever wanted to use a Firefox based browser because "I hate contributing to Google's monopoly" like the OP said, I would just use Firefox.
