Native Window Mode?



  • What does it do exactly? Is it only a reskin or does it really use Windows api to draw the window? For now, the only difference I see is that in Native mode I have a titlebar with 3 buttons (and this titlebar definitely isn't windows-based)


  • Moderator

    It merely puts a window (border) from the system around the UI.



  • I mentioned this already in the TP3 candidate blog but I think this is a better place to describe my issue with native mode…

    The problem for me is that it just adds extra wasted space. I use tabs at the bottom since it makes the browser a bit prettier with the tab colour all along the top section, and it also adds the page title at the top - which is nice and clear:

    [attachment=1142]VivaldiTabBottom.png[/attachment]

    When I switch to native mode, I would expect to get almost the same look, just with a window border… but I get a lot of wasted space instead:

    [attachment=1143]VivaldiTabBottomNative-3.png[/attachment]

    Which is why I suggested that (after TP3) I think Vivaldi should:

    • add the page title in the native title bar
    • if tabs are at bottom, move the Vivaldi button down to be next to the navigation buttons
    • if tabs are at bottom, delete the remaining empty bar

    When tabs are at top the Vivaldi button is half mixed into the tab bar, so the second and third requests above don't really apply.
    Attachments:
    ,



  • @Ayespy:

    It merely puts a window (border) from the system around the UI.

    erm. Please look at this:
    [attachment=1144]Capture-2.png[/attachment]
    Firefox window is all fine and dandy while Vivaldi's window isn't even following my color theme, not mentioning the buttons.
    That's what I am confused about - everyone talks about 'native' and 'system' but I don't see any of those on my pc so I wondered if I was misunderstanding something
    Attachments:



  • @Andys:

    erm. Please look at this:
    [attachment=1144]Capture-2.png[/attachment]
    Firefox window is all fine and dandy while Vivaldi's window isn't even following my color theme, not mentioning the buttons.
    That's what I am confused about - everyone talks about 'native' and 'system' but I don't see any of those on my pc so I wondered if I was misunderstanding something

    What Windows version are you using and how do you have it set up?

    I'm assuming that is Vivaldi at the bottom of your screenshot with the pale blue Title Bar ? (would be easier to tell if the image went a little lower on that window).

    If so, it looks more "native" for Win7 "Basic" color scheme (i.e., with Aero disabled), while your Firefox window looks more like "Old School" Win9x_2K (pre-WinXP).



  • I'm on Win7, 'Windows Classic" theme with custom colors



  • @Andys:

    I'm on Win7, 'Windows Classic" theme with custom colors

    That's what I thought (although I had to look it up on my Win7 system after I posted to see what it was called).

    It appears to me that the Vivaldi window is the Win7 "Basic" theme (just to the left of the "Classic" theme under "Basic and High Contrast Themes" at Control Panel\All Control Panel Items\Personalization.

    I'm just guessing here, but maybe the "Basic" theme is considered the "native" appearance for Win7 when transparency is disabled. If so, I don't know if there is a way (other than maybe som extensive CSS mods) to get Vivaldi to look like your Classic look, as that isn't "native". (Again, just an educated guess.)



  • Funnily enough many people (me included) wants exact the opposite: no native decorations in Linux to avoid some wasted space.

    http://forums.opera.com/discussion/1847276/titlebar-on-linux-1606-build/p1



  • @mossman:

    ….The problem for me is that it just adds extra wasted space....

    ....When I switch to native mode, I would expect to get almost the same look, just with a window border... but I get a lot of wasted space instead:

    [attachment=1143]VivaldiTabBottomNative-3.png[/attachment]

    ~
    Try this in your custom.css :

    #header {
    	min-height: 0 !important;
    	z-index: auto !important;
    }
    
    

    I use it for a different reason (to hide the title bar, but leave the menu and window controls - Thanks, An_dz), but it might help you with this issue.

    It may also cause complications, as one or both of those 2 remaining elements may end up somewhere on your Address bar.

    If so, then THAT can be tweaked to make room for them though, using margin and padding statements.

    I use the horizontal menu, so the exact code which I use for it would not match the V-button.

    BTW, this stuff could save you space, even if you are NOT using native mode.
    ~



  • @gdveggie:

    I'm just guessing here, but maybe the "Basic" theme is considered the "native" appearance for Win7 when transparency is disabled. If so, I don't know if there is a way (other than maybe som extensive CSS mods) to get Vivaldi to look like your Classic look, as that isn't "native". (Again, just an educated guess.)

    Yeah, I suspected you would come to this conclusion too.
    That's why I hoped one of dev's would clarify if this is a 'real' windows border, or just a 'skin' drawn by devs. I read a thread here on forum which suggested this 'native' look, and I believed it would be done through actually using windows api
    btw, I wonder, does changing 'primary' color in Windows Aero theme also change color of Vivaldi's border? Or is it permanently blue (can't check, years ago when I installed Win7 I removed all aero support from it, can't remember what I did back then, maybe even deleted some dlls)



  • Judging from the transparency in my screen capture, I would say that it is native window painting - but that for some reason it doesn't support the win95 style borders in gdveggie's classic theme.

    @davesnothere - thanks, but I'm not that bothered; quite happy to stick with Vivaldi's own look. I was just thinking about improvements that Vivaldi should make for default native mode.



  • I'm just chiming in to say that I love the native mode.

    The non-nativity of the UI was one of the main drawbacks I saw in previous versions of Vivaldi, and was holding me back from actually using it.

    The native mode does what I want (integrate with the rest of the UI and let me take advantage of muscle memory for menus, etc.), and in my preferred configurations (tabs at the top or on the side) doesn't have problems.

    The only missing thing I see is that the active tab's title should be shown in the title bar, and isn't, at the moment, under Win 7. The title bar is always empty. But I trust that they will fix this.

    Now if I only could get an MDI close tab button in the rightmost corner of that menu bar… :)



  • I have a similar problem. I use Windows 7 with the Classic theme, but no custom colours, and Vivaldi's window doesn't take the Classic them – instead, it takes on the Basic theme. What's more, as mentioned by others, the window bar has no title (which is one reason I use Chrome as little as possible).

    [attachment=1148]vivaldiwindowbar.png[/attachment]
    Attachments:



  • I'm not sure if ff really uses native controls to draw button and tabs on titlebar BUT just ading (empty) titlebar that STILL is drawn extremly slowly isn't anything tat helps



  • @mossman:

    Judging from the transparency in my screen capture, I would say that it is native window painting - but that for some reason it doesn't support the win95 style borders in gdveggie's classic theme.

    Just clarifying that it is Andys with the Classic theme. I (gdveggie) am using the Basic theme with no transparency. But it sounds like you've answered another question that was in the back of my mind: Does the "native" Win7 with transparency actually have transparency? Sounds like it does on your system.



  • Hey, how did you get Vivaldi to show page title in window title bar?? I am missing this feature badly!

    (Edited: Although I replied to a certain message, this forum didn't include any reference to it in my reply. So, my question was directed to mossman who posted a screenshot with page title.)



  • @me76:

    Hey, how did you get Vivaldi to show page title in window title bar?? I am missing this feature badly!

    (Edited: Although I replied to a certain message, this forum didn't include any reference to it in my reply. So, my question was directed to mossman who posted a screenshot with page title.)

    He just moved the tabs to the bottom, and the title bar appeared =)
    He also mentioned it in same post



  • What Gino said…

    You also have to have the Vivaldi button instead of the menu.



  • That sucks… do you guys know if a title bar is going to implemented in near future? If not, I'll submit a request.



  • @ugcheleuce:

    I use Windows 7 with the Classic theme, but no custom colours, and Vivaldi's window doesn't take the Classic them – instead, it takes on the Basic theme

    Filed a bugreport VB-7663, ugcheleuce I hope you don't mind, with a link to your screenshot :)


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