Simple Browser
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:silly:
Where are the good old days where the browser was for browsing. Nothing else, no emails, no fancy graphics, not add on programs.
Back then you had only 256 kilobits connection and the browsing was faster (ok not faster, just a bit over the top) than now at 20Megabits speed, but with browsers that are full with adverts, email links etc.Ahh them good old days of viruses popup adverts and java attacks by the dozen. Yup how I miss having a fresh installation of windows virused into oblivion and spending another few hours repairing the damage.
I remember fondly, happily waving to people on the train as they sped by my poppy field where I had my computer on my desk lovingly putting right every bit of the damage spammers, data theft artists, identity fraudsters and adware merchants could throw at me. Oh happy days -
Ahh them good old days of viruses popup adverts and java attacks by the dozen.
….....and then we moved to Linux.
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@RRR13:
I hope it finds some way to make a very good paid version.
I can't speak for everyone, but I would not continue using Vivaldi if I had to pay to do so. I'm perfectly happy with most of the free browsers that already exist.
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I wouldn't like to see those resources to be wasted on such things as a mail client. There are plenty of mail clients out there and computers have heck of a lot power to use two programs at the same time. And besides that, everyone uses their smartphones to read mail, right? Wouldn't these kind of features be the ones to be outsourced to developers?
By the way, I think managing limited resources in a company is the hardest thing.
Bite your tongue!! First of all, Jon stated explicitly first crack out of the box that there would be mail, and that it is being worked on. The inclusion of mail, by the way, was one of the primary reasons to even write this browser in the first place, and is one of its primary guarantees of regaining and retaining the old Opera 12 user base - LIKE ME. If I don't get integrated email, there is basically no reason on God's green earth for me to switch to Vivaldi.
You do not understand the benefits of having an email client persistently visible in your browser window, and that's fine. But because you don't understand it, you believe such a benefit does not exist. If you understood my work flow, you would say "Oh, I get it. It's actually essential." But you don't, and so I counsel you to not recommend the absence of features just because you don't get why someone would rely on them.
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@RRR13:
Not surprised at all. A lot of people think browsers grow on public trees.
So, if you are perfectly happy with most free browsers that already exist, why are you here?!
I'm here for the same reasons that a lot of people are here: I was a fan of the pre-Chromium Opera, and I enjoy testing new software.
As for free vs paid browsers - all of the most popular browsers, and the vast majority of browsers I'm aware of are free. I don't see Vivaldi or any web browser going very far in the market if they charge for usage, or even if they have both free and 'pro' versions. Not when the competition like: Firefox, Chrome, Maxthon, Opera, Yandex, Sleipnir, and so on are all free. I can't even think of a premium browser not designed specifically for mobile that hasn't died due to lack of a user base or public attention. Premium browsers don't do well in the market.
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Charging people to use Vivaldi just to be set apart from other browsers is quite possibly the worst reason to charge for a product that I've ever heard. It makes the software sound pretentious - like the user base is exclusive.
Example: "Bah, if you can't pay to use this browser then you should just stick with Google Chrome like the rest of the riffraff."
Making the browser free will always be more welcoming than charging for it to any community.
So, what are some examples of major browsers rich in features that happen to be free?
!
Mozilla Firefox:
! - Highly customizable- Tab grouping
- Vast extension library
- Downloads manager
- High Security
- Impressive loading speed
- Data syncing
- Fullscreen GUI
- Huge and friendly community
- Helpful devs who listen to users
- Doesn't use the Chromium, Blink, or WebKit rendering engines
! Maxthon:
! - Highly customizable- Data syncing
- Notes
- Reasonable extension library
- Night mode
- Reading mode
- Media grabber
- Active, albeit small, community
- Devs who try to be helpful, and do listen to the community
! Sleipnir 4
! - Highly customizable- Data syncing
- Tab groups
- Uses either Blink or Trident engines
- Fullscreen GUI
- Social networking integrated
- Support for Google Chrome extensions
- Reasonably secure
- Attentive devs
! Still feature rich, but not quite as much as those listed above, are:
! Comodo Dragon
[Sleipnir 6](Sleipnir 6)
Torch
Yandex AlphaBut do feel free to give me examples of popular, feature rich browsers that require users to pay for use.
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BTW people asking for a simple browser here reminds me the duke of Edimburg in Rome…
On being offered fine Italian wines by Giuliano Amato, the former Prime Minister, at a dinner in Rome, he is said to have uttered: "Get me a beer. I don't care what kind it is, just get me a beer!"
:lol: :lol:
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This comment indicates you are completely unfamiliar with the WAY in which SeaMonkey "integrates" its email, or with the way in which Opera did it, and why the two cannot actually be compared. The benefit of email in Opera was that one could keep the mail account and email list visible and open while working on the web, and shift back and forth between email and browsing seamlessly, which was/is essential to my work flow, for instance. This is impossible in Sea Monkey, which hides its inferior email client while you are on the web. In fact, in order to try to duplicate the functionality of old Opera, I have to keep a browser open in the right 3/5 of my screen and an email account and mail list open and visible in the left 2/5 of my screen at all times, which is of course also impossible in SeaMonkey.
The fact of having an "integrated" email client does not make SeaMonkey in any way similar to old Opera.
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Can you actually have a version of the browser that have nothing fancy on it. Just browser. I don't want to import things, see adverts, fancy flash graphics. Just browsing. If I need to go to a page I can type it… (I still have fingers and brain cells, thanks GOD), don't need links to overload the browser with add on stuff just so I don't have to use my brain.
You don't want any downloading either in the browser? Images off? Maybe a console browser like Lynx is for you.
By the way, one of the major fortes of Opera was absolute configurability. If you wanted your browser to do nothing else but browse, you could configure it for that, and remove all buttons and menu items that do other things.
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This is entirely true. Old Opera was the only browser in the world that could be as simple or fancy as you wanted.
With Luck, Vivaldi will allow similar flexibility.
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… one of the major fortes of Opera was absolute configurability. If you wanted your browser to do nothing else but browse, you could configure it for that, and remove all buttons and menu items that do other things.
+1 many times over. The longer I use browsers (and I have, since their inception), I find that their degree of configurability comes to outweigh almost anything else (assuming they have a reasonable assortment of features). But then, I've always used a browser as a tool, not as a glitzy multi-media viewing appliance.
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Never heard of Seamonkey ? Integrated mail client is nothing new.
Looks like YOU never tried it, not the others "never heard".
The email client of netscape communicator/seamonkey is a STAND ALONE program.
The only integrated thing is the menu item to launch it.
Well, not quite. If it were truly stand alone, you could open two windows and view both web and mail at the same time. However, you can only see browser OR mail, never both together, which makes it worse than if the two products were not packaged. The way old opera had them integrated, you could see your mail list and a web page, plus your bookmarks bar, etc, at the same time. Or, if you had an actual email opened, you could still see your other tabs, bookmarks, et al. SeaMonkey makes that impossible. I counterfeit that effect here, by having email and browser open in partially overlapping windows. But it's still not satisfactory.
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Yes, maybe "stand alone" is not a 100% correct description.
Maybe a suite of independent programs "badly glued together" is a more accurate description.
The only things that vaguely resembles the Opera functionality, is sticking the Metro mail program on 1/4 of the screen and use a browser on the remaining 3/4.
Something that anyway wasn't possible when win 8 was released.
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Yes, exactly.
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Never heard of Seamonkey ? Integrated mail client is nothing new.
Netscape Communicator and Opera had that long before Seamonkey even existed :p
BTW: I can remember Mosaic 0.98 - which came out short after the WWW was invented - it had a built in news client ("news" like in newsgroups / usenet) …
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@RRR13
I still completely disagree, but your opinion is your opinion.
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@Sajadi:
Let's see it that way, for example for a good Antivirus solution most people are also willing to pay, because it is simply useful and/or offer features which free solutions in most cases do not have.
Not exactly the best example.
Firstly because the antivirus sw is (still) a mass marketed SW, secondly because some free AV are surely way better by some paid ones.
The point here is that aside some little open source projects (like Otter) nothing is free.
You will pay in different ways, currency/privacy/relax.
What you pay per copy is highly dependent by the SW diffusion. NO MATTER IF IT'S FREE (as a bier) OR PAID.
So let's do some simple math:
Vivaldi right now was downloaded 400k times.
Try to think that 1/10 of the users pays 10€ for it. wold be a 400K euros of income.
Then think to the cost and the tax and likely less than 200K € will remain to pay the developers.
Is way not enough.
And the some will apply for ads charging. Vivaldi users are power users. Most of them would use adblocks and tracking blockers, and anyway arent tens of millions, so ads are hardly an option too.
If the numbers are so small, a paid version would likely cost 100€, not 10.
How many of you would spend 100 € for something available for free elsewhere ?
That's Vivaldi challenge.
Keeping the browser free or cheap would mean to enlarge it's user base, would be very hard (Opium proved it) and would delude the historical Opera users.
"Selling" the browser for an high price, or for a monthly fee will be hardly accepted by the users.
So, I believe, the only viable alternatives are a combination of both of the above, or a totally Open development, like happened with Netscape and sons.
I really hope Jon wins his bet, but is not easy.
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@RRR13:
I keep seeing this "you can get it for free" crap all over these forums.
It depends on the meaning of the "free" word.
If you could, these forums would be EMPTY.
That's not true at all.
Instead the opposite is true.
W/O the open source movement most of modern commercial SW would be nonexistent or poor.
Aside Vivaldi which is based on blink, which is based on the KDE project, think to macos, think to IOS and Android, think to the Windows network stack and so on.
Even the original Opera that is mostly original, includes an endless list of free sw, as you can easily read from the credits.
Thinking the there is an equation "free=bad" and "paid=good" is unfair, to say the best.
