Broad goals/objectives of Vivaldi browser



  • I just heard about this and of course I'll be following the development of this browser. Best of luck. I do have one question. I'm wondering about the overall plan of browser development. Is the main idea of it to: (1) slap the Opera 12.16 or the best of pre-Opera 15 onto the blink engine? (2) Make the fastest browser in the world? (3) Or??? In other words, what would make this browser unique?



  • From what I read in their homepage and their CEO said to some other websites this is what I understand:

    • Its a browser for friends, this means old Opera users.

    • Its surely targeted to the market that Opera had in the past. This means power users.

    • The browser will be the fastest, but not exactly in speed of website rendering, but speed of usability. This means to be very fast in how you can use it to browse the Internet. For speed rendering it already uses Chromium under the hood which is amazingly fast.

    • It will have decent amount of features and customization, so you don't rely on plugins. Which I think is a good idea, as I don't like plugins and extensions that much because they are insecure. I don't want remote code updating in my browser. Also default things work better than extensions in most cases. I don't think an extension should be changing GUI things in a browser, it just works bad.

    • The browser will serve its community. This means they will develop the browser based on the feedback of users. They plan to actually listen to users and be focused on users and what they want or need.

    Check this:
    techcrunch.com/2015/01/27/vivaldi-the-four-browsers/



  • Thanks. It will be something for me to keep an eye on.

    I'm not entirely certain that I'm his target audience. I've tried the old Opera over the years, but always went back to either Chrome or Firefox. Rather than wanting a browser that does more than any other, I want one that just stays out of my way and lets me do what I want–quickly and (if I can get a smooth interface) elegantly.

    Regardless, I'll keep an eye out for future iterations, if it can get extensions (Adblock is a must for me).



  • Wonder what other think about that.

    That browser runs chromium engine which makes it yet another chromium user. My hope was to certain extent to revive presto ar do something better. You cannot beat opera or Chrome by using their core.



  • @petarp:

    You cannot beat opera or Chrome by using their core.

    actually - when you forget about the unavoidable bugs and lack of refinement of a preview - Vivaldi has already beaten Opera and Chrome, it is already the better browser, at least from the point of view of its target I guess.



  • Maybe I used strange wording beat Opera and Chrome :)

    I am more questioning the starting point. Start developing another browser on chromium … a bit better than using mozilla :) Why not starting from scratch or start from where Presto left the game?



  • Because we wouldn't be sitting here and have a tech preview but rather wait another 5 to 10 years. Maintaining and updating an engine is consuming lots of resources. I'm really glad Vivaldi is based on Chromium so they don't need to worry about that but can concentrate on making the best UI and start innovating like Opera did during its heydays :)



  • @petarp:

    a bit better than using mozilla :) Why not starting from scratch or start from where Presto left the game?

    search the web and you will find an interview with Vivaldi's founder: he says they had considered Mozilla too, but considered mozilla and chromium equal, and starting from scratch would have required too much time, quite understandable line of reasoning to me.



  • @petarp:

    I am more questioning the starting point. Start developing another browser on chromium … a bit better than using mozilla :) Why not starting from scratch or start from where Presto left the game?

    I believe there are several answers - Some would at least in part be along the lines:

    Using Presto:

    • Presto is property of Opera Asa. They wouldn´t just hand it over for a competitor.
    • this was mentioned somewhere: Presto is now 4 years behind
    • maintaining your own browser engine requires a lot of manpower

    Starting from scratch:

    • a lot of manpower just for engine development
    • find yourself in the corner again where you have to fix compatability issues because you do it by the standard but for some reason blink/webkit/IE do it differently

    Somewhere i believe read this team has currently 20 devs. I know nothing about the business model of this browser and community thing but i don´t think Jon will drop his cash forever into this without a return. Even with other parties investing into this browser - at this time i believe its not easy to make money with it. (hell - i would even pay for Opera again Vivaldi )

    i am typing to slow … two replies while i was typing.



  • Also, using a proprietary engine would severely impact adoption rate, as people wouldn't be too eager to optimize things for a niche rendering engine.



  • Vivaldi does not have the men power and money to do its own rendering engine. And why would they? Opera failed as well with Presto.

    Don't forget that while Opera was a great browser, Presto had problems and issues. This is why it never gained mass market.

    Vivaldi is small team, it would be amazingly stupid for them to go with their own rendering engine because they don't have the resources to do it. (money and time).

    If you want to wait for a new Opera replacement for 20 years, then I don't.

    And why re-invent the wheel? It makes no sense. Blink is open source and works great. Even when I dislike Chrome, I like its rendering engine. You have to admit it loads things very fast, this includes heavy javascript pages. The engine just works and its widely accepted and most developers code for it now so its very compatible.

    Presto was already dead way before Opera decided to go with the Blink engine.

    Creating your own rendering engine costs millions and millions and you will never have more money than Google or Microsoft, even Firefox is struggling now and losing market very fast.

    Remember Vivaldi is financed by its own owner from his own pocket. They are not earning anything yet. People saying why they don't revive presto don't know what they are talking about. Presto does not belong to them, they can't use it and even if they could it would be a dumb idea to do so when you have a great open source engine at your disposal which is so much better.



  • @petarp:

    Maybe I used strange wording beat Opera and Chrome :)

    I am more questioning the starting point. Start developing another browser on chromium … a bit better than using mozilla :) Why not starting from scratch or start from where Presto left the game?

    1. Presto is not open source. It does not belong to them and nobody can use it. Opera never open source it exactly for that reason, so no clones or forks would be made. So that answers your why.
    2. Vivaldi is a team of 30 persons, not hundreds of developers or even thousands like other browsers. No time !!!
    3. Nobody would code for a niche engine that only has a couple of users worldwide. Everyone will code for Webkit/Blink. At the end of the day you want a browser that works with your websites. Presto never did.
    4. Who is going to give Vivaldi the billions to do it? You will? How much did you pay so far or donated to Vivaldi? You do realize the owner is spending his personal money into this company and so far they had no profits. Be realistic. Its a start-up not a multi-billion company, not even Opera could mass market their own rendering engine, they lost.
    5. Why in the world re-invent the wheel. That is dumb. Just use what you have right now.


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