Vivaldi browser and open-source



  • @LeBaux said in Vivaldi browser and open-source:

    There are ads, but we made them easy to remove.

    What ads? I've never seen any ads in my Vivaldi installs, nor have I ever had to "remove" them.


  • Vivaldi Team

    @potmeklecbohdan: Well, heat death and the universe and all that. Pretty hard to overcome that one 😛



  • @julien_picalausa said in Vivaldi browser and open-source:

    heat death

    Assuming that's how it actually ends... rather than a big rip, or crunch, or some other currently unknowable future.


  • Vivaldi Team

    @pathduck: I'm hoping that if we somehow manage to all become billionaires, we'll all realize that we have enough money that we can just open source the whole thing and maintain it for fun 🙂


  • Vivaldi Translator

    @BoneTone said in Vivaldi browser and open-source:

    What ads? I've never seen any ads in my Vivaldi installs, nor have I ever had to "remove" them.

    There are the initial bookmarks which come with every Vivaldi install. And the default search engines (bar Google) could be seen as adds since they are also from sponsors.


  • Ambassador

    @BoneTone , not banners with advertisings, Vivaldi use default search engines from sponsors and default bookmarks from others. All this you can delete, if you don't use them.



  • @Chas4 said in Vivaldi browser and open-source:

    Presto ... RAM usage was compared to Chromium, 175 tab and 25 Windows RAM usage still under 800MB.

    To be fair, if you used the current Vivaldi browser to browse the pre-July 2013 web, you might get similar numbers. Content is richer now, and the rich parts are larger. While the design paradigm of Chromium does use more memory per tab than some other designs, the really large memory consumption comes from the content.

    I also remember Opera Unite. I have a few old Opera wallpapers from Opera 9.5 era.

    Content was even lighter in 2008.

    Even operating systems have a mix of open-source and closed-source code code. Apple has a list of open-source here https://opensource.apple.com. Parts of some apps Microsoft has are open-source now https://opensource.microsoft.com.
    Each company has to find its balance of open and closed source code.

    It's great to see this put into the larger context to gain some perspective. How many mixed source software shops host a forum where they let users post mods effecting their closed source assets? I'll assume there are others, the world is a very large place even limiting ourselves to this planet, but Vivaldi is the only one that comes to mind right now. Users still exhibit a great degree of control over even the 5% of the browser that is closed source, either through the customizations Vivaldi has built into the product, or through community-based code that we can insert into the application ourselves.



  • @Komposten said in Vivaldi browser and open-source:

    There are the initial bookmarks which come with every Vivaldi install. And the default search engines (bar Google) could be seen as adds since they are also from sponsors.

    @Catweazle said in Vivaldi browser and open-source:

    @BoneTone , not banners with advertisings, Vivaldi use default search engines from sponsors and default bookmarks from others. All this you can delete, if you don't use them.

    If default bookmarks & search engines qualify as ads, I don't know of a single browser that doesn't have ads upon initial install. Which kind of renders the point moot, it's nothing different and irrelevant to the topic. When people talk about ads in browsers, they're talking about things that are displayed alongside or on top of the content being accessed, for which Vivaldi has a built-in blocker.



  • @BoneTone gif are not much bigger today and a website that is 96% text should not need 2GB of RAM, Google has ignored the RAM usage for a long time others using Chromium have not. The RAM usage is also an issue for lower end devices, as 1 tab should not make a device completely unusable for anything else, I also remember Chrome from back around 2008 having the same issues. Also content was not lighter in some cases it was much heavier (Flash Player & Java plug in performance on macOS).

    Open-source and closed source projects can push each other to get better with performance and features.



  • @LeBaux said in Vivaldi browser and open-source:

    TLDR: Money.

    Man! Did you miss the point... 🙄


  • Ambassador

    @Chas4 , perhaps those with a small PC should remember that Windows incorporates a function called ReadyBoost (in W Vista up to Win10), with which they can fill some system deficiencies with a pendrive.



  • @LeBaux said in Vivaldi browser and open-source:

    TLDR: Money. Not that there is anything wrong with it.

    But I find the argument about protecting the brand and being afraid of forks bit ironic since you rely on chromium. Without it, there is arguably no Vivaldi. This is de facto a fork of chrome. So you benefit from open source tremendously.

    What this article is missing is how is Vivaldi giving back to opensource. I genuinely don't know. If there are lot of upstream contributions to chromium or other libraries, it would make this whole argument a lot more sound.

    Not to mention you ¯_(ツ)_/¯ged security with, let us know. I know you might mean well.
    With all respect, I think this blogpost missed the mark.

    Something closer to reality is:
    We happily take chromium from Google. They are rich assholes and chrome sucks. We made it better, but we also need to eat. There are ads, but we made them easy to remove. We made it impossible to fork Vivaldi further. We think it is fair. We still keep most of the stuff open source, because you know, we have to (pesky licences).

    Lastly, I still love Vivaldi and respect the business model. I just don't love this blogpost.

    seeing as google are rich assholes as you put it then is there any particular reason why google have not created such a web app as vivaldi themselves...?...

    i have asked this before on this forum and still await a response...i just find it odd that google have not taken it upon themselves to make chrome for example as customisable..


  • Ambassador

    @Priest72 , anyway quite suspicious than Chrome, despite being much less functional than Vivaldi it is much more resource hungry.
    I'd already be interested in what hidden codes other than the Chromium base cause it.


  • Moderator

    @Priest72 said in Vivaldi browser and open-source:

    i just find it odd that google have not taken it upon themselves to make chrome for example as customisable

    Google have not done this because there is no threat to their market share. They are too big.

    Were chrome smaller and suffering as a result of browsers whose main selling point was customisation, I can guarantee you that more customisation would immediately appear in chrome.


  • Vivaldi Team

    @lebaux: I think it's important to point out here that Google has basically successfully positioned Chromium to be the de facto web standard, which means that the only way to make sure a new browser doesn't break web pages is to fork Chromium. Because of this, forking chromium isn't just happily taking from Google, it is following the standard, whether we like it or not. And in addition, anytime someone chooses to fork Chromium, they are reinforcing it as a de-facto standard, giving Google more power.
    Also, we do upstream some changes to chromium. Not as much as we'd like to, because their process is rather involved and time consuming and we do not always agree on how things should be done, resulting in some of our attempted contributions being rejected.
    As for money, well... yes we need to eat, but we also believe that whatever income we made should be done so in an ethically sound way. That in part means being transparent about our stance on different topics, which is the actual point of this blog post.



  • @Catweazle Would not do much good in the USB 2 ports


  • Ambassador

    @Chas4 , not much, but an improvement of 10-15% can be decisive, in some cases the performance may even be greater.



  • Great! vivaldi-source_3.1.1929 code is available in https://vivaldi.com/source/



  • @julien_picalausa: Will I find there how to fully access e.g. the tabs api - including the changes you (<- i.e. Vivaldi) needed to make the tab stacks possible?
    Especially to which stack a tab belongs, where it is positioned in the stack etc., and can I access the methods / properties in an Extension?
    If not, it is as good as if there is no API at all.


  • Moderator

    @QuHno Stack & tiling stuff is accessible via the chrome.tabs.Tab.extData API, and can be used by mods and extensions. However, the stack, or "group" as it is referred to, is just a random ID and I don't know of any way to do anything further with it.


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