Privacy is not just a personal matter



  • @Pesala said in Privacy is not just a personal matter:

    How much data are you willing to share to help combat the spread of Covid-19?

    Problem is: That data's not just going to be used to combat the spread of Covid-19!


  • Moderator

    @Eggcorn So, better to die or kill your friends, than to offer any fodder to "big data."



  • @Ayespy How about "none of the above"? Also, Pesala wasn't talking about the American Big Tech companies. He was talking about government (unless I've misunderstood).


  • Moderator

    @Eggcorn Which implies you will personally do your own contact tracing and notify everyone who may have been in contact with you during the potential transmission period, of which you were not even aware. Is your last name Giuliani by any chance?



  • @Ayespy Not a problem for me: My family is high-risk, so we're staying locked down. Not because anyone made us, because it's the smart thing for us to do.

    And frankly, that's what you've got to do if your high-risk. Stay home and stay safe. If you can't afford to catch the Wuhan virus, if you could die from it: Contract tracing isn't going to protect you. You got to stay home. That, or go out and accept the risk of dying. Your choice.


  • Moderator

    @Eggcorn Contact tracing is not to protect you. It's to notify those to whom you may have spread the virus, or even to notify those (possibly asymptomatic) from whom you have have contracted it, who need to know they are spreaders. If you're basically just staying home (as are my wife and I, skipping Thanksgiving and Christmas with family, so that we might have years' more of them in the future), then the app doesn't apply to you, really. But to discourage use of an app that may save lives because "it will feed big data" strikes me as selfish and paranoid. In extremis, we do things we might never have considered doing in normal times, and then clean up the mess afterward. the important thing is to resolve the current crisis. Then repair the (arguably lesser) damages our resolution might have created. Stop the car from rolling downhill and killing people NOW, deal with your torn meniscus later.



  • @Ayespy I'm paranoid, because I don't want the government installing software on my computer (or smartphone)? Because I don't want the government tracking where I go, who I talk to, etc.? Because I don't want to live in a surveillance state?

    I think you've got it backwards: You're the one who's paranoid. And if we create a surveillance state due to our paranoia, there's no guarantee that the surveillance state will go away when the virus does.

    I think you should re-read Mr. Tetzchner's article, and the article he links to. Particularly these bits:

    How often have you heard someone say: “I know privacy is important, but I really do not care. I have nothing to hide”. The problem with this thinking is that your privacy is not only about you. When our collective privacy is lost, there are consequences for us all. The fact is that our every move is being tracked. This makes us more careful about what we say and do (not that the trolls care), and keep our opinions to ourselves.

    Maybe you are an immigrant yourself, documented or not. Or maybe some of your family is. Or maybe you have friends or coworkers who are. How likely are you to get involved [in immigrants’ rights movements] if you know that your interest and concern can be gathered and used by government and corporate actors? What if the issue you are interested in is pro- or anti-gun control, anti-police violence or in support of the police? Does that make a difference?


  • Moderator

    @Eggcorn You missed part of my reply. "Then repair the (arguably lesser) damages our resolution might have created."


  • Moderator

    @Eggcorn And you are accusing someone who has investigated, solved and cured actual, real conspiracies of being "paranoid." I'm probably the least paranoid person you have ever dealt with, as I deal in provable facts, and weigh actual evidence prior to making decisions.


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