Sync: Status update



  • sry for delay, done



  • On Windows 10, latest snapshot (1111.3) I am having a lot of issues with sync between my work computer (Win 10 1709 Enterprise x64, with 64-bit Vivaldi) and tablet (Surface Pro 4, Win 10 1709 Enterprise x64, but 32-bit Vivaldi). I have had to log in to Sync each time I start the browser all day, and now tonight it is telling me my encryption password is incorrect on the tablet. (even though I've been typing it, I know it's right) I'm at this weird point I can't log out because it's waiting on me to type a correct encryption password.

    Not entirely sure the best way to proceed.


  • Moderator

    @justin_42 I know on Win 10 desktop if it gets stuck like that, you can close the browser (make sure all processes close) and start again.



  • I've now been able to sync between two machines - everything looks good so far.



  • @cab404
    I have the same trouble. Can't logout because vivaldi crashes.
    Vivaldi 1.15.1111
    Arch Linux.
    Yesterday was the same problem but after a few crashes vivaldi has started successfully.

    Upd
    I just did it: logout, login, clear server data and login again. Now everything works.


  • Vivaldi Team

    @zakius: Vivaldi is making its own path, meaning that not all of Opera's features will be implemented unless we see fit / the community really wants it, right. We aren't an exact copy, we are just a product based on the same ideals.



  • @aronand yeah, Opera also needs some improvements so exact copy wouldn't be a perfect solution
    but as long as basics aren't here there is nothing to sync since browser isn't (and can't) used at all

    surely you don't have to implement exactly everything into the browser, but since chromium extension API is sub-par there is not much choice unless you intend to provide proper extensions API and hope that people will create extensions just for you (I'm absolutely not against that, but some things will benefit greatly from being implemented natively)


  • Vivaldi Translator

    @burbuja Could you be more specific? Thank you very much.


  • Vivaldi Team

    This post is deleted!


  • @zakius said:

    since chromium extension API is sub-par

    Well, it's the chromium extension API that vivaldi is built using. If you find it sub-par to begin with, then there's no hope at all for vivaldi. I'm curious to know what you find lacking about the chrome API?



  • On Manjaro with vivaldi-snapshot 1.15.1111.3-1 i get this Crash

    How can i start vivaldi-snapshot without Sync?

    Linu74



  • @lonm no way to run extensions in browser context, no way to use extensions to modify interface, no way to use Web Workers (partially worked around by Event Pages/Scripts, unfortunately you can't use Background Pages/Scripts if you use them), Content(basically User)Scripts can't be run on internal pages and some websites chosen by Google

    Chropera's implementation is slightly extended by partial support for their sidebar, WebExtensions standard is still evolving and adding some of missing features, yet conceptually it's still completely broken since most of limitations are there by design too



  • @cheekybuddha: this was the same behaviour in Opera Presto.

    Slightly annoying but since it's now a bug, maybe this will somehow be addressed. I suggest a feature would be to prompt the user if they want to discard the local settings - but only if there are settings already on the server!

    In the meantime, I do as I did on Opera: first delete all local bookmarks and notes and only then enable sync.



  • @zakius Look at the opera add-ons sidebar category. After all these years only a few extension which use the API have been written. Don't think it makes much sense. And the modding of the interface you can do in Vivaldi directly, no need for extensions.



  • @zakius

    no way to run extensions in browser context

    I'm not sure what you mean, the whole point of the extensions API is that it opens up the browser context?

    no way to use extensions to modify interface

    Extensions can add buttons, popups & badges, they can add context menu entries. In Vivaldi pages they offer can be added as web panels. In addition to extensions, Vivaldi can load in mods that customise the interface.

    no way to use Web Workers

    Fair point, I've never come across this issue but that seems annoying.

    can't be run on internal pages

    Enable this flag to do so: vivaldi://flags/#extensions-on-chrome-urls

    conceptually it's still completely broken since most of limitations are there by design

    That's a contradiction.

    To tease this out into practical things Vivaldi could do, could you name some specific extensions that just can't exist in the chrome extension ecosystem?


  • Moderator

    If you have Sync crashes and can not start Vivaldi, try this:

    1. Disable Network or disconnect LAN cable
    2. Start Vivaldi
    3. Open Vivaldi Settings โ†’ Sync
    4. Sync will fail
    5. Select button Switch user
    6. Close Vivaldi
    7. Start Vivaldi

    Worked for me. (may be step 3. and 5. is not needed)



  • Another way works on my Side.
    I rename 2 Folders in /home/user/.config/vivaldi-snapshot/Default "Sync Data" and "Sync Extensions Settings"

    Linu74



  • Thanks for your efforts.
    Will we have the ability to save a complete profile backup "offline" that can be restored locally in addition to the online Sync function ?



  • @lonm said in Sync: Status update:

    I'm not sure what you mean, the whole point of the extensions API is that it opens up the browser context?

    background scripts have very limited capabilities and contentscripts are run in website context
    it makes a difference for mouse gestures and keyboard shortcuts for example, but I believe there are many other usecases

    @lonm said in Sync: Status update:

    Fair point, I've never come across this issue but that seems annoying.

    makes a difference for a RSS reader for example, but I expect people to create other extensions that would benefit from parallelization

    @lonm said in Sync: Status update:

    Enable this flag to do so: vivaldi://flags/#extensions-on-chrome-urls

    checked it many times, in chrome, chromium and chropera all it does is expecting extension to request additional permission in it's manifest, it doesn't automatically enable them, though it may be different for Vivaldi

    @lonm said in Sync: Status update:

    Extensions can add buttons, popups & badges, they can add context menu entries. In Vivaldi pages they offer can be added as web panels. In addition to extensions, Vivaldi can load in mods that customise the interface.

    surely Vivaldi can be modified in some ways, though currently there is no user friendly way of managing them and many of them requite fiddling with files that get replaced with updates (just like manual edits to XUL in Firefox based browsers, it was possible but not feasible)

    @lonm said in Sync: Status update:

    That's a contradiction.

    broken from usability point of view, perfectly fine from it's designers point of view, these two unfortunately can be true at the same time

    what is impossible in chromium extension ecosystem?
    Fire gestures with ability to execute event while scrolling over tab bar (since contentscripts are run inside websites you can execute gestures only in website area and have to wait a while before code can get injected, and of course this won't work on internal pages etc. unless extension author requires the extra permission and user not only enables it but also pretends to ignore that obnoxious warning)
    Pretty much the same goes about all vim-like control extensions

    Pages and pop-ups generated by chromium extensions can't be consistent with browser itself nor with OS since webtech doesn't provide proper UI elements nor styles to apply (there is appearance property that doesn't work anyway)

    @luetage said in Sync: Status update:

    Look at the opera add-ons sidebar category. After all these years only a few extension which use the API have been written. Don't think it makes much sense. And the modding of the interface you can do in Vivaldi directly, no need for extensions.

    that's why I think it would be nice to be able to create proper extensions but if basic features are not provided by Vivaldi's team (either as built-ins or extensions) these won't be provided at all



  • @zakius I understand the problem better now.

    I think there are definitely workarounds - I am perfectly happy with my current RSS reader extension that builds its UI in HTML instead of natively. I can add it as a web panel, no need for a sidebar API.

    And there are ways to communicate and pass messages between multiple components in an extension - I've been able to use a background script in an extension I'm building currently without any major issues. There are some odd quirks, but nothing that completely breaks what I'm trying to do.

    For the most part, I would take the security advantages of keeping things separated the way that google devs have chosen to build things - they understand the underlying setup of the browser better than me. And for less experienced users, warnings and hiding some features is a good security feature. (I would quite like it if vivaldi grew to have a userbase that also included less experienced users, so blanket getting rid of these wouldn't be a good start on that front).

    Though I do have one big gripe: Chromium bases its extensions API entirely on async callbacks, whereas firefox (implementing the same API) prefers Promises - These are far neater.

    And yes, It would also be nice if there were a proper entry point for what are currently referred to as browser mods.


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