Mail M3?
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@Pinkmeister RSS has not been mentioned backstage as part of the INITIAL RELEASE of M3. It has, however, been specified as part of future plans. Of course if you would like to submit a fully-coded and bulletproof email client built on top of Chromium and incorporating Vivaldi UI code, plus including RSS functionality (since this is, of course trivial to code) the developers would be deliriously happy to have it - because in nearly 3 years of coding, their email client is still not quite ready for public release.
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@Ayespy No, I don't care about mail. RSS has nothing to do with mail, but it was connected to the mail client in Opera, so I was expecting it to be connected here as well (despite it making no sense whatsoever). Mail is tough, RSS just... isn't. A developer over at Vivaldi could have it release-ready and tested in a month of work, completely detached from mail, as it should be.
So, stuck with Opera 12 until 2020, like I said.
@Gwen-Dragon I don't trust that extension, unfortunately, as it's not maintained any more... Can't have that on my work PC
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@kurai Astronauts need likes and posts on the Vivaldi Forum to get to space? That's bad news for space exploration, most won't even find us.
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@Pinkmeister I'm using this one: https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/the-rss-aggregator/ffhafkagcdhnhamiaecajogjcfgienom
The base code is from the Opera extension, but the author has expanded and refined the approach. Both smart rss and rss detector are combined into one extension and it's still being updated. Also has some bugs ironed out, which were pretty annoying on the original one.
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@slitkx said in Mail?:
With all respect to Vivaldi's developers - I do not understand why does it take so long to develop e-mail client. It is not a rocket science ...
Wow, we have a serious programmer here who knows best. Do you care to share your own Chromium clone with an email client? So we can compare.
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@slitkx Veteran users here get angry when the Vivaldi team is criticised in a belittling way. The rocket science remark triggered them. What goes around, comes around, it's your own fault.
But to answer this, they simply don't have the manpower to do it faster. Mozilla is on another level in that regard.
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Thunderbird came out from Mozilla suite, which came out from Netscape suite - so a lot of years of development. And the team is bigger.
I'd say that having a faulty mail client it's not a good idea - well a lot of veteran V users won't agree with me xD -
@slitkx said in Mail?:
... give me a clean and non-cynical answer, do it.
...Vivaldi's project is not so new anymore. Anytime I come to see if there is somethin new about e-mail client, all I see is "it's being developed, it's not ready yet". Very long developing cycle for one product.
When comparing to Thunderbird, it's useful to keep some timeline realities in mind. Thunderbird was spun off on its own and first released in 2004, pruned from an early Netscape/Mozilla developmental browser suite that included the Minotaur eMail browser and which itself dated from the 2002 or earlier development time-frame. Tbird was and is based on the Gecko engine, and its major feature upgrades occurred mainly in 2007 and 2011. Otherwise, its other versions have largely been stability/security updates in between and since those feature improvements. In comparison, Vivaldi, based on the entirely different chromium engine and released in early 2016, is barely an infant in terms of overall development time.
As others have noted, the Firefox/Thunderbird development staff of Mozilla during Thunderbird's primary development era was significantly larger than Vivaldi's current staff. Likewise for the development pace and staffing of Opera's eMail technology (based on the Presto engine) up through Opera 12, which was then simply re-issued later by Opera with the Internet browser portion neutered as their current eMail browser - which is no longer being developed by them.
A key thing to keep in mind is that if one is going to release an eMail browser or capability, it has to be done right - for each and every thing it does. It's one thing to have a web browser that has reliability issues accessing or rendering certain websites - after all, one can always use another browser. But in downloading or uploading an eMail, there often is no margin for reliability issues - in such cases, a dropped or lost message is just that: dropped or lost. Such consequences to a user can be major.
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For several months i deliberately avoided reading all V forum threads related to M3, as i'd grown tired of the incessant whinging of ignorant disrespectful newbies angry that the "obviously simple" task of producing an integrated email client had not yet been completed... given that "obviously" V has a Dev team of tens of thousands, & a budget of gazillions... oh yeah, & also "obviously" V Devs have had nothing else whatsoever on which to spend their time. Blimey i just "love" such myopic posters...
This morning i weakened, silly girl i am, & read this thread. Yep, more of the same. Sigh. However i decided to make my own worthless contribution, so i can play my small part in supplying irritation & irrelevance to other readers
Certainly i shall be interested to have a look at M3 once it arrives, but for at least the medium term i cannot envisage it helping me. Firstly coz IMAP is of no use to me at all, i need POP3. Secondly coz for me, for M3 to be truly revolutionary in allowing me to modify my workflow, by freeing me from Thunderbird+Lightning+AddOns, it would have to give me a comprehensive calendaring module of no less depth & competence than Lightning [with my preferred AddOns], & of course all the myriad functionality of TB's mail client [with my preferred AddOns]. Oh yes, of course it would also have to have a perfect data import function from TB+L [i would never opt to change to new software if it meant losing all my history]. If at some distant future point M3+C could do all that, such that on a daily basis all my needs were met simply by running V, instead of now V + TB, i would change to it in a heartbeat. Anything short of that holistic capability would render M3 merely a curiosity to me, not a contender. It is with this mindset that i always view much of the ongoing [& historical] chatter herein about M3 with a sense of surprise, as if email alone were sufficient.
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Since you brought it up ... yes, they are working on a calendar too. Not quite as mature as M3 at this time, so ... well, don't hold your breath in anticipation.
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Its time for Mail developers! Cant wait to ditch my Gmail Notifier Pro for good.
Even if its working fine let us use it and hide it behind vivaldi flags so that users manually have to enable it.
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@saudiqbal I feel ya. But data loss simply cannot be permitted at all - period. And it's an amazingly large and complex task. Looks like 3 steps forward and 2 steps back. Every fix or feature add breaks something that was working, which then has to be repaired, and on and on it goes. It really is getting measurably better and more complete over time, but just one bug that cropped up newly in the last week or so once again raises the spectre of data loss. I would be thrilled to see hundreds or thousands of people testing it, but it's just not ready...
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Is it going to be ready before this year ends?
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@saudiqbal I would hesitate to hazard a guess.
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You know, none of this data loss issue would be a problem if they had implemented POP before IMAP...
(in all seriousness, I still prefer POP because of this - and not wanting to leave my mail at the mercy of corporate interests)
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@mossman needless to say, I was expecting (a couple of years ago) to use POP for my initial testing of mail in Vivaldi for this very reason...
Since IMAP is more complex and dangerous, I found it strange that the team were talking about skipping POP altogether a few months ago. To me, it looked easier to build your basic local storage, indexing and interface around the POP method first (keeping IMAP in mind, of course) and then add the extra synchronisation functions for IMAP as a second stage.
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Mail must be getting somewhere because the latest snapshot has stuff like this hidden away in storage:
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You know, none of this data loss issue would be a problem if they had implemented POP before IMAP...
(in all seriousness, I still prefer POP because of this - and not wanting to leave my mail at the mercy of corporate interests)
Depending on how the software is written, even a POP3 eMail program can be dangerous to your data. Back some years ago, I was using an early version of PocoMail for POP3 mail, and it had a noxious habit of infrequently losing a previously-downloaded message while being manually dragged between folders. The errant messages simply disappeared without trace, never to be seen again and had even evaporated from the file structure. It could (and did) play havoc with rearranging an archive of saved, important messages. Later PocoMail upgrades cleared the bug, and I continued to use PocoMail for years, but the program finally went unsupported and became obsolete.
The point is that there are a lot of potential places and ways where glitches in coding can damage or lose eMails, regardless of whether they're IMAP or POP3, and not just in the uploading or downloading process. Given that eMails are a lot like photos, even one loss of a message is too many, so it all has to work right - all the time. I require my eMail program to be squeaky-clean about handling my messages with care, whether in transit, during manipulation, or in storage. And I get the impression Vivaldi devs view this the same way, hence the careful pace of development.
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That is why I have a separate spam gmail account for this purpose, thats why I am asking let us test us Mail and hide it behind flags so that people know what they are doing.